I hope people won't be rocked to sleep --- believing that this represents some type of panacea for addressing the myriad of deep-seated, serious, systemic issues and problems, which (under current overall conditions and arrangements) are hindering the ability to properly educate massive numbers of our children. It's easy to spend a billion dollars --- without producing one iota of fundamental, permanent change and improvement. It's been done (time and time again). My advice: Follow the money --- very, very closely. Despite Cuomo's flowery, optimistic, political rhetoric --- this initiative barely scratches the surface relative to all of the many systemic changes that need to be made (yesterday). We have to be astute enough to watch out for guys like Cuomo. In many respects, he can be compared to the fox --- watching over the hen-house, and besides --- the guy wants to be President of the U.S. . When people aspire to such lofty goals --- sometimes they will say and do most anything --- until....

Howard, hurling critical comments doesn't help things. How exactly would you have designed a teacher evaluation system? Is there a need for one at all? What is specifically wrong with the system Cuomo and the unions agreed to?

One of the big problems with political commentary these days from both the left and the right is the conclusory nature of it. Instead of just saying "its bad" or elliptical statements like "follow the money" which mean nothing, give us specific, targeted comments we can consider.

There are, more than likely, really good/bad teachers/students. The adults, that take the time, money, and effort to spend 6 years obtaining a masters degree to help children recieve an education - to the most part - are honorable productive members of society that simply are not able to reach enough of the children. Why? Because the teachers are not the parents.
The problem isn't the teachers when it comes to education. There may be some - just with any profession - that aren't that good or are possibly lazy. The problem isn't poverty either. This is an excuse. Adults make choices. Parents make choices.
These teachers chose to commit money and 6 years to become productive members of society. They, in general, are not the problem. And they want to be protected from the primary factor that is out of their control, but no one wants to deal with the real problem; the parents.
Imagine spending 6 years excited about your future career, and finding out that your dealing with damaged goods, and nothing seems to make much of a difference. There comes a point, which we are already at, that the general population realizes no matter what you do, its not going to make a significant difference, So the focus is the money, the paycheck; ironically just like the welfare system. And government keeps trying to help children overcome poor home life; not poverty. We dole out so much money. Society is broke. Parenting, successful parenting, has evolved to encompass a new open communicative world. Adults are just babies in big bodies. What on god's earth makes a person think a child can overcome poor home life without making prime news? We are wasting tax payer funds focusing on teachers. We need to focus our funds on changing our social system to be workfare. Until we force parents to be productive, nothing will change. Its not the childs' fault. Its not the teachers fault. Shame on the government for not wanting success...If they did, they would stop focusing on teachers and start focusing on nonproductive social systems that demean personal self esteem and do nothing to help parents or force parents to do their job and take responsibility for their life and their decisions.. They need help, and they will not do it on their own at this point either. Social programs need to change, stop being free, and become available funds that require time commitment in return. Period. To them, its free. Nothing is free...... look at the price of free....

I thought about one of my long-winded highly detailed responses.

Then I read rukosini's comment.
I don't need to say anything new. S/he said everything that needs to be said.
Howard said the rest.

A couple questions:

"Poverty is no excuse" is commonly asserted. Is poverty in any way a factor in student achievement? Are "excuse" and "factor" mutually exclusive in this instance? If poverty plays no part in student achievement, does this mean Rochester teachers are by far and away the worst in Monroe County and in all areas between Buffalo and Syracuse?

When a teacher confronted President Obama at a "town meeting," over the issue of "pay-for-performance," the President asked, "Are there any teachers in your school who you wouldn't put your own kids in front of?" and the teacher refused to answer, what reasons might she have refused to answer?

From Insatiable Dragon: "the President asked, "Are there any teachers in your school who you wouldn't put your own kids in front of?""

I can't remember which exact type of arguing this is, but the problem is that the question and the answer don't address the original issue.
I can think of a variety of reasons people wouldn't want their children in a classroom with a specific teacher, and I can also think of a variety of reasons why good teachers get poor "achievement" as measured by standardized tests. The reasons aren't necessarily the same ones.
A teacher who gets decent test scores may be the most boring drill-and-fill instructor out there, and may not encourage a great deal of creativity and critical thinking, while a creative teacher with high standards and neat lessons that encourage creativity and independent thinking may not get great test scores, but may be giving the students an experience they'll treasure and draw from for years. Which teacher do you want for your kid?
And that's only a single comparison you may look at to see why the teacher didn't answer the president's question. The president's question didn't address the issue.

Teacher evaluations are needed to fulfill mandates, but to think that they are accurate representations of a teacher's contributions to the lives of their students is to misunderstand the whole teaching activity.

If you were to swap the city teaching staff with the suburban staff and base teacher evaluations on student achievement, you'd be surprised by how many suburban teachers would suddenly look comparatively bad, and how many city teachers would suddenly improve - especially at the high school level.

Poverty is no excuse. It's a reason.

Rochester City School teachers should be evaluated and for the people think that they shouldn't that's your opinion.
Why do you think that the teachers do not want to get rid of Urbansky after he has retired b/c some of them can hide behind him,he needs to be out on the lake relaxing and taking care of himself stress is the #1 killer that causes heartack but b/c we love money we will do things even if it's not got for our health.
Our students have not had a District that has been about our children since the late 1800's check the history of Our school District. Not only do our teachers need to be evaluated but we need a whole system all together, district level and school board needs to be evaluated also.
This is a grand mess! Now we do have some parents that is not concern about their children's education b/c of being impaired themselves, they do not have the motivation to do so. I have been saying this for 34yrs why can't we have a parent institute to teach parent the fundamentals of being a parent and the duties that entails being a productive parent, and that we are to train a child in the way it should go ,but if you are liking the necessary skills you do not know.
We wont get nothing done if we just sit on our butts, talk about and down to the parents b/c we are in a New Millennium and the parents are getting younger and younger.
I have been in the company of plenty teachers that play their positions as a teacher but by the same token I have stepped to some teachers that should have been fired years ago so this is a give and take situation.
The teachers that was/ is in my children lives they know me personally( teacher/parent relationship) that I cut no shorts when it come to my children education I expect them to play their position as the teacher and my child play it's position as the student and we will get along but we need to stop pointing the fingers b/c we all have positions to play in our State, city county, schools, homes and community, so lets do our part because if we are talking about it and not adhereing to a solution you are part of the problems and the problems only going to get worst, so lets be about it instead of adding to the problems.
Let's stop talking about the welfare system are you aware of the history of the welfare system? Let's not speak on stuff, if you don't know the history or you just want to touch and go on subjects that of interest to you. The vast majority of our students in this district use to look up to their teachers but the teachers are coming in younger and younger and do not know the culture along with not coming in contact with black students just in their classroom so without knowing the culture you will not perform well with minority students and this what has been happening in the last past 10 yrs. the teachers trying to be the students friend, you can't be their friend and be their teacher too so some of them has created that stigma and now want to place all the blame on the parents.
What ever happen to challenging students energy, that's the old way, must I name a few teachers and administrators that yet has my individed attention Bono,(Douglas) Calvalier, (East) Larkins( #6) Hector( #4) Dodge, Winston, Perkins, Solomon, I do not think it will never be administrators, principals or teachers like these, Acknowlege the parent in every way made sure that we were informed if something wasn't right they did not hesitate to call that parent in with a conference even if they have to come to the home that's no more.
We have teachers and administrators do not want parents no where in the making just only want to deal with the students, so what you expect them to do, you want to treat them as though they are full grown adults and when the students call the teacher/s out her/his name then you want to call the parent and say your child is being disrespectful and by the same token you (the teacher) open up that can of worms sort of speak so stay in your lane from the begining and let that student stay in his/her lane remember that say you can play with a puppy long enough he will start licking you in the face, STOP TRYING TO BE THE STUDENTS FRIEND PLAY YOUR POSITION.
It is a shame and a disgrace how we do here in America and how our system has failed the people over and over again in American, but God is going to pay everyone according to their works and for the ones who took on leadership roles and has not handle your business and just only thought about the $ God is going to pay you double for our trouble,and if it's not you the bible states we will reap what we sow and if we don't our children, children will. Have a good day, evening or night!